What does The Bible Say about Fame? // S06E10

Does God want to help you become famous? When is the last time you heard someone say they want to be famous? When is the last time you were shocked at the reason WHY someone was famous? This week we dig into the roots of fame and how that plays into the Word.

VERSES FROM FAME-LESS:

 Matthew 20:16 Ephesians 2:14-18 John 10. Joshua 9, 1 Kings 10 and Hebrews 1:3

QUESTIONS COVERED IN FAME-LESS:

• What does The Bible say about fame?
• Is it wrong for Christians to have a goal of being famous?
• Is it wrong to want to be famous?
• How should a Christian view fame?

QUOTES FROM FAME-LESS:

`”We don’t have to strive for that fame in Christ. Like he gives all of that to us. It’s like, here you go. This is who I say you are. It brings equality. It’s beautiful. You know, he’s a reconciler of all men. We’re co heirs we’re equals.”

The Pantry Podcast, Shea Watson, Fame-Less

“You can see that again in the word that when you pursue and obey the Lord fame very well may follow you, but it’s for the glory of God.”

The Pantry Podcast, Michelle Watson, Fame-Less

Annotated Transcript:

Shea: What is the last time you heard someone say they want to be famous? When is the last time you were shot at the reason why someone was famous this week, we dig into the roots of fame and how that plays into The Word.

Shea: Hey, I’m Shea.

Michelle: And I’m Michelle.

Shea: There’s a battle being waged. It’s not flesh, it’s not blood, it’s spiritual, and we need to be prepared. The last thing a warrior wants on the battlefield is spiritual anemia. When the enemy attacks we need to be prepared

Michelle: We don’t always realize where the attacks are coming from or that we’re being attacked at all. This is the pantry podcast, and we’re here to remind you of who we answer to what we’re capable of, and how we are called to do it in every aspect of our lives.

Shea: This is season six, rewired when you’re saved, you’re saved for good, we all experienced sanctification differently. The more we grow in our relationship with the Lord, the more he transforms and renews our minds. The more we cut the cords of this world, the more we’re charged up in him this season, we’re arming you with the sermon of some of the culture’s most toxic snares

Michelle: Support our ministry, reaching the lost and found in over 50 countries with spiritual and literal nutrition. Every one-time and recurring donation makes a lasting impact, donate through Patreon or pantrypodcast.com. And now let’s dig into the meal.

Shea: Hey, hi, what’s up?

Michelle: I’m happy. Oh, you got me super excited, man. But no, I am super excited today. It’s kind of cool. The title today fame-less I mean, okay. That speaks for itself kind of in a lot of ways. Uh, cause I know in my life, I mean, that’s not the way that I would normally approach something, everything in life, the way that society is set up, the way that the world is set up, it’s about achieving and, and going forward and really like striving to be the best. But what drives that? I think that’s important to understand, especially in a Christian walk, what is driving? I know what in high school I’ll be really all in high school, playing basketball, football, and baseball. It was all about the accolades or the records, you know, did you get the triple-double in basketball?

Shea: So that would be like, you know, scoring double points, you know, like 10 plus 10 plus points in all of it, like shooting rebounding and assisting, right? So the triple-double or, or how many points per game or how many rebounds per game and I’m going to be real. It was not about like, I mean the team and winning, that’s always important, but it’s like getting the stats and beating it and it’s all self-driven, really, I think what we’re gonna talk about today is taking that perspective and being selfless. Am I right in that? Yeah.

Michelle: Well, yes. Yes, because I come up with the titles, but I think what’s cool is this when we discussed, we had two episodes that had no name. Normally we go into a season and they are already named and we just kind of fill in with that. But this season we have to the last episode that you don’t know the title of yet. And this one where both of them were like, what are we going to talk about? God, lay something down, like inspire us. And when you think about rewired, you think about all the things that the word of God can rewire in you. And of course, that’s limitless, but fame is a huge thing in just the worldly mindset. I remember growing up thinking fame was that quick solution where if you could just get famous money would take care of itself. Yeah. There’d still be work involved.

Michelle: I never thought fame meant no work, but it just seemed like if you were famous, you could do the same amount of work as someone who’s not famous, but make more money faster and have an easier life. And as I grew up, I started really listening to the song lyrics again, before I was with Christ, I would listen to the song lyrics. I would watch the movies. I would check out II and true Hollywood stories and VH1 and MTV. And I started realizing fame had a very dark side and that you would have these momentary lapses of, you know, quick-fix satisfaction, but you would quickly fall into being like you’re up on a pedestal, but you have to do certain things to stay there. And it seems like no one can ever live up to that standard. So the world tears you back down and you’ve got to deal with critiques.

Michelle: You wouldn’t deal with, you’ve got to deal with choices, temptations, all that stuff. And then I came to Christ and I was like, the world sets people up there in a very demonic way. Like if you look at it, it’s just like, just like when Jesus was taken into the wilderness for 40 days and Lucifer himself showed up with all of these tempting promises and the word of God prevailed every single time. But what was the theme? Power provision and protection. And I think in one of our life group studies a few years back, you said those three words, you know, cause you looked at it, but power provision protection, look, it lasted for building up your wife, praise God. But so that’s what we think when we think of worldly fame, we think of that. And my last thought on that before we get rolling is the other day we were talking about this episode and we’re in the car driving around filming reels.

Michelle: It was kind of cool praying over demonic spaces in our area that are just clearly bad. But anyway so we were driving around and there was a bus that drove by and there was this banner on the side of the bus. And it said in the biggest letters be internet famous. And it had internet crossed out because internet-famous ain’t enough because that doesn’t always get you the money that doesn’t always get you anything. They just cross that out with like be famous. And there’s a whole new app that apparently I didn’t, I don’t remember that, but his whole thing was, we’ll get you famous. And, and that’s the world spins with fame dangled. And when you look into the word where fame is mentioned and where people are famous, you see a whole different perspective. And so I’m really excited to unpack that tonight.

Shea: Right, constantly chasing, chasing the feeling, chasing the respect, chasing the money, chasing whatever you’re chasing that puts you into that famous thought position or, or under the understanding that you’re looking for basketball, you know, it’s like you, you start, you know, you start out in, in ninth grade. I mean, I got on varsity quake, but a 12 points game and you’re like, I want more. Right. Then you get 14 points a game and it just grows. And I mean, by the time I did it, I mean, okay, seriously, I do hold some records in Colorado, a 44.5 points a game in district playoffs. And let me tell you something, it wasn’t enough. I wanted more, I wanted more. You know, maybe more attention from my family or more attention from people like, oh, that was so great.

Shea: And, and you know, you get a little bit of it, but you’re like, you’re just looking for more. It’s like an emptiness, there’s this emptiness involved. And there was nothing that was filling me up and it just, I just wanted more. And then it transfers over to the army and it just keeps growing. It’s like just more, more, more, but where do we find this filler? And then I found Christ. And it’s amazing that you go from needing the opinions of the world to learning how God sees you. You know, it’s like Matthew 20:16. And, and this is kind of where my mind went on this and just stick with me in this real briefly. But Matthew 20:16 says so the last will be first. And the first, last for many are called, but few are chosen. And we got to understand the context of this.

Shea: This is talking about the Gentiles and the Jews. And we really have to understand that the Gentiles and the, there was a, there was a difference. You know, it was like, it was like the Jews had always had gotten Jews, had the temple, the Gentiles had to be in the outer courts of the temple. You know, there was never this blending together. And it’s like, when Christ came on the scene, it was the Jews or the, excuse me, the Gentiles who would accept him. And it was like when he’s sitting there saying, so the last will be first and the first will be last. He’s like, you’re not even receiving, you’re not taking them in. You’re not accepting me for who I am. You know, they had this mentality, you know, that they were set in their ways, of course. Right. There’s that separation between the Jews and Gentiles.

Shea: The Gentiles could only worship in the outer court. Right. Jews were established full access to God, man. They were like the religious superstars, you know, it’s like, okay. So they had the fame, like when it comes to God, it was like the fame, the superstars. Right. But Christ came in to break down the barrier, break down the walls and they didn’t understand this. He wanted to create equality amongst people. Right. Do you know? And when we think of fame, it’s like, okay, y’all yeah, we do a podcast. I do not think in my head, I needed to be famous. In fact, I’m like, wow, Christian podcast genre. Or like, there are so many Christian podcasts. It’s like, I’m good where I’m at. You know, it’s like, but what’s cool about this is the equality in Christ. Like we don’t have to strive for that fame in heaven.

Shea: We don’t have to strive for that fame in Christ. Like he gives all of that to us. It’s like, here you go. This is who I say you are. It brings equality. It’s beautiful. You know, he’s a reconciler of all men. We’re co-heirs we’re equals. It’s just beautiful. But in fact, that’s all it comes from Ephesians 2:14-18. By the way, if you read that, you’ll get what I’m saying here. You have to dig into it though. You have to unpack it. You have to see who he is, who Christ is talking about, what, what the story is behind the scripture. But I liked verse 18. It’s like this, and this is the truth. When we’re in Christ, y’all Christ will use people. Christ will give people more viewers, Christ will, or, or viewers or church or whatever it is, Christ God uses people in how he wants to use it. It’s our mentality though. How are we going to receive this? But watch this for, through him, we both have access. This is talking about Jews and Gentiles in this, by the way, but this is now us, right? We all the world, if we come to Christ, have access through him by one spirit to the father. Yeah. And we, and we can be famous.

Michelle: You know, it’s funny because when you were talking about the Pharisees, they were the famous of the day that an often fame comes with clout and discernment is key. As a believer. One thing he gives us is the holy spirit for the sake of discernment. So that we do not have to rely on the assumption that they’re famous, because they know what the heck they’re doing and what the heck we’re talking about. Just because they’re a household name. That doesn’t mean that they speak the truth. But when the Pharisees were denouncing and rejecting Christ, there were those trusted so heavily in their understanding because of their stature, that they two assumed the worst about Christ. And we are freed from the influence of that. When we have access to the father, we’re free from having to rely on someone’s fame, their accolades, their title, and we can trust in him.

Michelle: And it led me to John 10 because that’s where he’s talking about my, I am the shepherd and my sheep know me, and I know my sheep. And it says, my sheep hear my voice. And I know them and they follow me. It says yet they will, by no means follow a stranger, but will flee from him for, they do not know the voice of strangers in our world today. There’s a lot of people who know the voice of strangers better than they know the voice of Christ because of where they get fed each day. Instead of turning to the word, which will reinforce an understanding when you hear something, you’ll know whether or not it aligns with scripture. But if you go back to the world and rely on what experts of anything in the world have to say, then that stranger’s voice you’re actually familiar with it. And that puts you in danger of elevating what they say. Even if it contradicts scripture, you’ll, you’ll be convinced. Scripture must not mean what I thought it meant because this expert is saying differently and it’s because of fame. So our goal is to read the word of God, which he’s left to us so that we have that clarity. And I’ll just leave it there for a second

Shea: I’m thinking about this and I’m thinking about what you’re saying. I’m thinking about I’m going to leave the world out for a minute and just come into the Christian thought because honestly, there is no wisdom in worldly wisdom. Now people will sit there and probably beat me up left and right over there. Oh. But I can get good, but is it coming from God? And so we have to think of this godly. I mean, okay. Read Proverbs. I would challenge back and say, okay, look, before we get into discussion re Proverbs, because Proverbs is very specific on where we’re supposed to get our wisdom. Right. And I think that when we’re not using the wisdom that comes from God, and we’re allowing, like you said, to allow wisdom from the world to come in, right. What does the world say? I need to be, does the world, you know, in this instance, we’re talking about being famous.

Shea: In other words, taking a step back from what the world is telling us about famous, you know, being on top of it, getting everything, you know, achieving this, having the greatest cars, the greatest boats, this and that. Look, if you got them, you got them. But let me tell you something. If you don’t get them, it’s okay too. But it’s like, where is our wisdom going to be? And, and, you know, and it takes me back to Paul and especially for the Christian, it’s like, okay. So are we allowing the wisdom of the world to come in and penetrate and not letting the Bible speak? Right. In other words, are we allowing worldly wisdom to come in? And it puts up a barrier, okay, we’re going back to the barrier between my father and me. And when I start to sit there and I think about this, and I think about this barrier.

Shea: Well, once the barrier goes up, I am no longer in a position of discernment. And Paul actually, I love Paul with the Corinthian church, right? He goes to him and in first Corinthians three, he says, I gave you milk. Not solid food makes sense. We should all start out on milk. Do you know? And, and as we learn the spirit, as we learn the voice, as we learn how the spirit speaks to us, how he communicates with us through the word of God, sometimes the spirit speaks in other ways, but you know, usually generally 90 something percent of the time, he speaks through the word of God. And he says, not solve it for you. We’re not ready for it. He says, indeed, you are still not ready. I want to see more believers, more Christians, more people of faith. You know, that believes in Jesus Christ to be ready, not, not ready.

Shea: Right. Fame lists humbling ourselves to the word of God and not listening to everything that we hear in the world and think that that’s where it needs to be. Yeah. Show me in more than two hands. Think of famous people. Think of famous people that have been in the world, their names, but you’ll still hear them today, but where were they at the end? Where were they mentally, physically, spiritually at the end? Right. And I have to say that when I look back, some of the people that I was raised around and that was famous at my time, I don’t hear much about them. Or I hear some really horrible things that break my heart about them. And I’m not saying that’s a hundred percent. I’m just saying when we strive for worldly things, king Solomon has wisdom to take care of his people, God loved him because he asked for wisdom and said, I’m going to give you wisdom. But he asked for wisdom to take care of the kingdom. Unfortunately, he didn’t ask for the wisdom to take care of his own heart, his own soul. And as we read out of, of, of king Solomon, we see that he’s with women that are worshiping other gods. And he’s right there in that mix.

Michelle: We have to ask, when I think now, as we start talking, the title has all these different meetings. I always love because less fame, more father, you know, like, are you going to elevate the famous above the father’s word? Are you elevating and prioritizing fame in your life and achieving fame over the provision that the father will give you. And when you look in the word, cause I looked at okay, how many times is fame renown? Those kinds of words, where are they in the Bible when they’re used? And this is one thing we have to sit on. And it, and it bleeds into a lot of times where it’s like, people will attack believers that have money because you know, well, the root of all evil is money. Well, it’s the love of money. That’s the root right. Money is a tool. It’s, it starts in the heart.

Michelle: And you can see that again in the word that when you pursue and obey the Lord fame very well may follow you, but it’s for the glory of God. And so saying every Christian that has people that know their name is doing it for the wrong reasons. It’s not necessarily the case, but that’s where again, just sermon comes into play because you can get fame the demonic way, or you can get it the godly way. There are only two ways to get fame right inside or outside of Christ. And the way of the world to get fame means elevating yourself or someone else or something other than God. Right. But the fame that you’re not promised fame, that’s not what I’m saying. But I am saying that when I looked into it in Joshua, it says, so the Lord was with Joshua and his fame was in all the land.

Michelle: And then in Joshua 9. It says, they said to him, your servants have come from a very far country because of the fame of the Lord, your God for, we have heard the report of him and all that. He did Egypt. So Joshua was only famous because of what the Lord was doing. But they were affiliated because they were seeing what God was doing in part, because Joshua, so Joshua was involved, but he was not where the fame was coming from. He was just affiliated with the only one that needs to be famous. Right. And then you mentioned Solomon and in 1 Kings 10, it says now when the queen of Sheba heard about the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the Lord, she came to test him with difficult questions. She came to him because she heard about the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the Lord.

Michelle: So fame may follow you, but it won’t be because you’re great. It won’t be because you’re wonderful. People might say that, right? Because, Hey, if you’re like Christ, there’s gonna be some positive qualities about you that people might like them. But at the same time, if they hate you, remember they hated him first. Right? So you will still get pushed back. You will experience a different way about it, but then the threat becomes, do not get in it in the pride aspect where it’s me. And it’s my schedule. It’s the flashiness versus in true humility where you’re kind of always worried about being prideful, but you know that there’s grace to kind of cover down on you. Then you’re more, you’re less likely to be all caught up in the pride bubbles. And just sitting there, checking in praying, and being vigilant about making sure that you’re not trying to perf Sue or force fame and renown for yourself, but that you’re so about getting the word of God out there and fulfilling the great commission that your name will get out there. Cause you’re out there, you know, you’re out there. Some more people are gonna recognize you, but it’s not because of you.

Shea: Right. Right. And I like that profits were famous. They were famous. Nobody liked well, okay. There are people. Cause there’s always the believers that are like, yeah, yeah man, the people are doing it wrong. They’re doing all these things. But they were famous in a different way. I call them famous. Like, like, cause they were fame and less. Right, right. It was like fame. I liked that too. Fame, less, you know, less humble yourself before the Lord. Right. Selflessness All of these things may go through the beatitudes. We just did that in a study too. I’m not gonna break them down here but just go through the beatitudes. And, and I like to think of it as like the attitude to be right. And it’s like, none of them are sitting there saying like, I’m flashy. I got my role at you gotta realize, look, y’all, don’t beat me up.

Shea: We should be praying for that provision where he takes that. It should always be his glory to his glory. Not our own glory, not just the flashy. I got this, I got this, rolling with a different crowd. Do you know? It’s like, some people will start to make it in ministry. It’s like, they feel like they got to change their crowd. And I’m like, why, why keep, keep going after who God puts you after, you know, if God moves you into another discernment and the holy spirit speaking, and God starts moving you into different platforms, never forget the other platform. Do you know what I’m saying? It’s like, don’t and I don’t know, I’m making sense on that. But it’s like, it’s like in other words, be humble and everything that you do and allow God to be working. Never let yourself get in front of God, but falling, falling behind God, and let him lead the way. Yeah.

Michelle: You make me think of the phrase. You hear it kind of reword it a lot in different platforms, in different complex social media places. Even in interviews, you’ll hear like sometimes they’re not for that season. Right. And okay. Yes. Sometimes the people are not for that season. Sometimes the circumstances, not for that scene, et cetera. Right. But they also say surround yourself with people. You want to be like, again, not the worst. Like, Hey look, the Lord says, be like him and how are you gonna be like him? Well, don’t fellowship with darkness. He says, I don’t fellowship with darkness, but okay. You’re a pastor. And you’re surrounded by people that need to be fed the word you are maybe more well-versed in the world because of time because of dedication. What have you, that doesn’t mean you don’t hang out with your congregation. That’s weaker because you need to be around other pastors that get it more, you know like that’s a very obvious example, but an individual believer you think, well, I’m at the next level of belief.

Michelle: Sometimes we are at different levels, even in our own understanding. And that’s iron sharpening, iron that’s humility. Sometimes the Lord will put you under someone that at least from the outside or from your assessment gets it less than you, but it’s to sharpen the both of you and work in human there are so many levels. And so we always, as you said, check-in on where like, where is my heart? Like a heart audit, you know? And you have God audit your heart using the word of God. So you check in on the word of God because it convicts us where we need to be convicted. And it encourages us and build us up where we need to be encouraged and built up

Shea: The story of two pastors. A really good friend of mine. One’s a lead pastor and one, you know, works underneath him and I never knew the story of how they got together, how they met. What’s interesting is the pastor who was underneath the lead pastor One was the pastor who led and discipled the lead pastor. Wow. And so basically the transition is so famous, right. To be able to step back and just be in the grace of God, the light of God, the walk with God and, and to see them work together is beautiful. You would never even think that like one discipled the other into Bible college, and one goes through Bible college gets a calling and then through circumstance brings them back together. And no one has any bitterness or any like animosity, right. It’s just this beautiful orchestration of God bringing two men together and building a beautiful ministry. And I think that’s where we need to.

Michelle: Yeah. It’s not something that’s brought up immediately upon introduction. Like, Hey, did you know

Shea: Yeah. And it’s amazing. And, just two beautiful men of God who, whether they were to, you know, rise or anything as of this date, you know, cause you know, man’s heart has to always be challenged. We’re always looking into our own hearts. Like you said, milk and meat. There are some things that I’m still on milk. Like in the word of God. I’m like, I don’t quite understand it, but I got to dig deeper, and the deeper I dig, then that becomes more meat. It becomes more substantial. So if you take the whole thing is like, it’s either meat or milk. It’s like, then you kind of like cut yourself off too. He’s like, I know everything. No man. There are things where I’m meat.

Shea: I’m like what identity? Yo, I learned identity because I needed an identity. Like I was chasing the wrong fame and I really all I wanted to do. And I learned all I want to do was become fame less. So the father could chase me and tell me who I was, but you know, but then you get the other portions of it. But my walk with Christ is me, you know? But it’s like, never think that you have it all together. Oh, I’ve got the foundation. Right. Or that you think that you’ve topped out and this is, you know, we can always improve. Don’t stop thinking. Don’t think we’re telling you not to improve or strive to be better or, or look, do your job to the glory of God. Do everything that you do to the glory of God. Do, everything raise your kids to the glory of God, give your kids to God, give your job to God, give your car to God, give your life to God. And I think, no, actually I know, I know that he’s going to elevate you to where he has you. I mean, where he’s already placed you because your elevation is not of this world. I’m sorry. Y’all it’s into the kingdom and, and it’s.

Michelle: Yeah. And it’s important to realize that the pressure we put on ourselves to get better, do better. It comes back to him. He’s the only one who can do it. Our forced changes within ourselves in and of ourselves is moot. And that’s just, that’s what the devil wants you to think. It relies on your own strength, your own willpower, your own ability to grasp and then walk in the word. But it’s going back for that meal over and over again, because that brings you to that, that peace, that passes understanding where you understand it’s the work he’s doing in us. That counts. That’s what sticks. That’s what lasts through until eternity and our own efforts exhaust us, discourage us, and can even falsely puff us up, but they don’t have lasting results. They, they exhaust you. And you’ve said this before. Jesus is our Sabbath because he gave us the ability to not toil, to do our own, get our own way, get our way in.

Michelle: And when you think about what God has done, it’s just commonsensical that he would be the one whose fame. We want to get out there because he can not be rebuked. He can not be critiqued in any meaningful way. Right? All those would return void against him, but he always returns with a loving response. Even if it’s a stern-to-the-point response, he’s delivering truth, and to deliver truth is to love someone. And when you have him delivering this truth to others around you, that’s, that’s what this is all about is wanting him to get out to more people and to be somewhat a representative I’m okay. Being the person like that’s helping people backstage for the Lord, who’s out front and center because that’s what he’s called us to do. And, and it’s just, it’s just so comforting that I no longer need to think fame is the way I just need to get fame. I just need to get the numbers. I just need to get the traction. His protein provides it all. You know, I love it.

Shea: Love it. And you know what let’s, as, as we, you know, we’re rolling this down, right? Let’s think about this Christ. The one who came, the one who died, the one who was buried, the one who rose again, you know who he gave glory to God. And it’s kind of beautiful because in Hebrews 1:3 t says this it’s like, watch this. Now think about this. When we give it to God and we give all the glory to God and we put everything to God, we just become your reflection. So then everything that’s reflected in us is a reflection of God. There’s nothing that can stand against God. So, therefore, if we’re reflecting these attributes of God, man, can’t stand against us. When I bring in my own attributes in my own thoughts, then there’s opportunity. But watch this and Hebrews one, three, he is the radiance.

Shea: This is Christ of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature. And he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the majesty on high Christ was a reflection and there was beauty in that reflection. So as we go out there and look, be famous, right, be famous, but be famous for Christ, be famous for God. Do what he’s asking you to do. I think that that’s the best way to live every biblical character as messed up or not as messed up as they were reflected in the word
That’s how we know them got beat up really bad people who already bad. Do you know what? We just go out there, do it.

Michelle: Yeah. And this week’s question of the week is how will you bring more fame to the Lord with your walk-in Christ? That is the question. And that, that doesn’t mean that doesn’t put a lot of weight on you. Like, oh, without you, he can’t get it done. He wants to bring you in because that brings you and invokes that purpose in you. So how will you use your walk with Christ to bring him more renowned, new, more fame with those who don’t know him yet? So go ahead and share your answer@thepantrypodcast.com or on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, you know, we’re all over the place, but our predominant places are Facebook, Instagram, Tik, TOK, you know where to find us. So until next time, bye.

KEYWORDS: HOW TO BE FAMOUS. BEING FAMOUS. FAME. CHRISTIANITY. BIBLE VERSES ABOUT FAME. WHAT DOES THE BIBLE SAY. BIBLE VERSES ABOUT BEING FAMOUS. WHAT IS THE POINT OF CHRISTIANITY?