RED TAPE WITH GEORGY ROY // S03E12
Our good friend Georgy Roy joins us again, this time to talk about what can come against you from the powers that be—the red tape that can make, depending on where you are, worshipping the Lord freely a tough (and maybe even life-threatening) task. How are we to navigate oppressive and hostile waters? That’s this episode!
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VERSES FROM RED TAPE WITH GEORGY ROY
Nehemiah 6:3-8, Matthew 28, 2 Corinthians 4:7-9, Proverbs 5:23, Proverbs 13:22, Proverbs 12:3, Leviticus 26:8
QUOTES FROM RED TAPE WITH GEORGY ROY
it amazes me that we use the word of God so much for our own profit, but fail to use the word of God so much for the profit of the kingdom. We can say that I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me take that load out of context and use it for every blessing that we want to achieve. But then we don’t want to take that word out of context and use it to fill the kingdom or to expand the kingdom.
Georgy Roy, The Pantry Podcast, Red Tape
I’ve been pounding this verse like the last month man. Cause I love it. I love the idea that like we have so much strength when we, when we’re in Christ, we have so much strength when everything is just put into his hands, into his lap. We’re not focusing on what’s going around us. We have our minds on, on the kingdom, right? We have our minds on heaven. We have our minds on God, on Christ and in Leviticus 26:8, watch this, this is the power that comes from this five of you shall chase a hundred and a hundred of you shall chase 10,000, 600 million Christians in India by standards, by percentages, by everything.
Shea Watson, The Pantry Podcast, Red Tape
Stephen is a beautiful example and an inspiration of how we have to look Heavenward just like Georgy said, and Nehemiah is a great example of the attitude we have to have when these things come our way, because there’s going to be people that are coming our way and laws and regulations that bog us down. But we have to just focus. “I’m doing an important work.” There was confidence in that statement. He wasn’t just saying he’s doing an important work, there was confidence that God was behind him. So he would complete it as long as he didn’t stop. And so even though it’s hard and discouraging, it’s important for us to keep going, not get distracted, not go down to the level of all of that and just do what we’ve got to do and follow God’s call and just move through it.
Michelle Watson, The Pantry Podcast, Red Tape
ANNOTATED TRANSCRIPT
Shea: Hey!
Michelle: Hi!
Shea: Man. I’m excited.
Michelle: You’re always excited.
Shea: I’m always excited. Always excited when we bring someone else in. So, man, today we’re talking about Red Tape. I know there’s a lot of people with a lot of definitions on that. And I came up with one on the internet, on the internet from Urban Dictionary because you go there because, you know, Urban Dictionary has it down: When you want to do something, but it’d be a pain in the butt because of many complications—red tape. That is what I’m talking about. Cause you know, there’s a lot of things, especially as Christians. Some countries see this right away. Some countries are catching up. I know the U.S. is starting to migrate more towards silencing the Christian and there’s a lot of things that are coming into play, but in a lot of countries, and I think this is going to come up through the episode. There are things that are trying to suppress the message of Jesus Christ.
Michelle: I like the idea of this episode being the last episode of season three, Warship Is Our Worship, because this whole season, most of the episodes have been all about what you need to correct in yourself and what you need to watch out for what you need to fix, what you, the mindsets you need to have. But this time we’re talking about something that you actually don’t have much control over when it’s being done to you. It’s not about what you’re inviting in. It’s not about what you have allowed into your life. It’s kind of based on where you are at. Red tape tends to be what is put in place by some kind of authority that is outside of your influence. So we decided to bring in a dear friend that we met back in season two in Ripe Fields, or—we renamed it Hand Lettered Hope to kind of go back to his roots as a hand lettering artist. But his name is Georgy Roy. And we have gotten to know him so much more. Y’all we like vidchat him all the time. Our daughter Calia knows him. And if you have been with us that long, you know who he is too. He has amazing word. And we wanted to bring him back to just give you more of the awesome stuff that he has in his head. So welcome back, Georgy!
Georgy: Hey bros. Wow. It’s an early morning.
Michelle: Like we’re always trying to talk to one another and it’s always like, wow.
Shea: Yeah, that little app. It really lines it up. That thing’s awesome. By the way, you know, Hey, it’s 8:30 here. It’s six there.
Michelle: Cause it’s nine and a half-hour time difference.
Georgy: Yeah. Yeah.
Shea: So, you know, when we’re thinking about red tape, we’re thinking about things that suppress, I think, in the olden days, back in the days, right back in the days, there was actually a red strap around binders or bound, documents and those documents were confusing and all that stuff. And so when they would go into these documents that were sealed with this round cord, they would actually cut through it. And so that was like cutting through the red tape to get to all of this. Like what is this? Right. So when I think of this, I think of cast down, but on conquered. And so that’s kind of where I, you know, someone asks you, you know, to, to kind of fill in with that, share something with us on that, about, you know, getting out of being the Conquered and being the Victorious.
Georgy: Well this life is always with ups and downs, but the primary focus for our life is Jesus. I believe so. As long as we have our eyes fixed on Him, crushed, but not destroyed. That part makes sense because we see Jesus and He is victorious over all. He was crushed by us, but then He rose up victorious. And now He says that you and I will be standing with Him forever. That is a perspective that can increase like a brain booster right now where we can say that I can be crushed right now, but I know that I’m going to be upstanding complete with the crown on with all the glory of Jesus.
So that as believers, we should never forget what can make this idea of being crushed so much or I’m being put down so much, but when you travel a lot you are going to get home, but that makes you keep going through that traffic. That thing makes you keep going through that tiring driving thing that pushes me and faith as well. Right now I can be in a dark season, but I know that I’m going to a place that is beautiful and prepared where there’s a room for me, whether it’d be no more shame, no more pain, no more discouragement, no sickness, no one death, no more, no more sin. And then that is a home it’s like, okay, I got a six miles and that home that is being prepared. Remember that now, but we won’t be forever, man. I liked that. I liked that.
Michelle: It’s like I could lose everything, but because I’m a kingdom citizen, I’ve lost nothing. Yeah. It makes me what you said. Makes me think of Stephen. You know, he’s the epitome that we would all love to say that we are, but we’re not all going to be. We’re not all destined to be stoned to death for our faith, but a book of Nehemiah it’s incompletely about Nehemiah getting permission to go rebuild the temple and all of the people that kept coming, trying to sabotage this process. And I think one of the most famous verses that comes out of Nehemiah is in Nehemiah 6 in verse three, he’s realized that they were plotting to harm him and that they were revisiting him trying to stop the process, delay the process, distract him. And so when they send a message to him asking him to meet them and go away from where the temple was being rebuilt, he said, so I replied by sending this message to them.
I am engaged in a great work, so I can’t come. Why should I stop working to come and meet with you? Four times they sent the same message and each time he repeated it. And then the fifth time they came with an open letter, you know, that were, there were rumors and all that and lies all built up in the letter. And his reply was in verse eight where it says there is no truth in any part of your story, you are making up the whole thing. And he said, they were just trying to intimidate us imagining they discourage us and stop the work. So I continued the work with even greater determination, but I think of red tape, not always as making it impossible, but slowing us down and distracting us and making it really hard, trying to play up like trying to discourage us before we complete something so that we want to give up on ourselves.
And we won’t even blame them because, well, we’ll say, Oh, you know, I’m not smart enough to figure all this out. I don’t have enough time. I don’t have enough money. And I think when they stack enough chips against you with laws, you know, I can think of, you know, financial and tax laws and you know how you have to file to how you have to identify. You know, every country’s different, you know, Georgy is in India, we’re here. China comes to mind as one of the most recent countries have put things in place to make it hard to get government aid. If you are a Christian and you refuse to refute Jesus. So I think it’s important when we, when we think of things like this to think of, Hey, you know, Stephen is a beautiful example and an inspiration of how we have to look Heavenward just like Georgy said, and Nehemiah is a great example of the attitude we have to have when these things come our way, because there’s going to be people that are coming our way and laws and regulations that bog us down. But we have to just focus. I’m doing an important work. There was confidence in that statement. He wasn’t just saying he’s doing an important work. There was confidence that God was behind him. So he would complete it as long as he didn’t stop. And so even though it’s hard and discouraging, it’s important for us to keep going, not get distracted, not go down to the level of, of all of that and just do what we’ve got to do and follow God’s call and just move through it.
Prolonged silence.
Georgy: Yeah.
*Laughter*
Shea: I mean, Michelle just dropped the bomb. You know what I mean? It was good. It’s good. No, I, I, as I’m listening to that, you know, Stephen came to mind as well. When I was thinking about the red tape and how the message was never stopped, his message continued all the way through the stoning, through the, through the dying. In that sense of, you know, die to self, pick up your cross and follow Jesus. I mean, he literally shows that, you know what? Death was more glorious in his death. He received his room, like Georgy said, his place that God had built for him. And that’s a beautiful story and I love the Nehemiah. I love the work like, nah, you know, you can’t stop me. You know, he didn’t die, but he just kept going. And I think that that’s a really cool, tie in how you did that. It’s beautiful.
Georgy: Yeah. Like you said, every, every nation I replace is different or every place or every life has a different purpose, a different calling. The ultimate purpose though remains the same than our life here in India. We go through a lot of ups and downs regarding now. It doesn’t come up as a surprise for me and the family or there’s a local church. We train ourselves with the word reminding us that, Hey, these things are bound to happen. This is what the Bible has already talked about. That things can be even worse than this, but we know that God is with us and that there is a beautiful joy. There’s a peace, there’s this love that is available in second Timothy life in Christ that is bound to happen. But they also remember obedience in such situations as not an option. I’m reminded of David Centerbridge that as a war hero. And then all of a sudden you see armies and Kings chasing just to get him, even in those distressing times, even when he’s running, even when he’s hiding, he calls out from the Hills. He calls out from the caves. He calls out from behind the rocks and even questions, God. And he even asked for help. He does all of those things, but never less God’s side. He asks a lot of questions. He cried a lot of time, but he didn’t leave any of this bronze that does not bear fruit, no longer bears fruit.
Now, if we think of ourselves, we know that we are the church, body of Christ. If we remove ourselves, push ourselves away from faith or from Jesus and allow the situation, our lives just to go on. Normally the church will continue to grow. It won’t affect the main tree. So our motive, even in any trying times should continue to preach the word, to share about our faith, to declare the gospel to many. That is what Jesus said in Matthew 28. That is not an option. If you know, it says that you have to get it. You have to do it. Jesus. Even on the cross, he says they don’t know. So just, just forgive them. I’m not sure how many of us, I’m not sure about me. Forget everyone else. I’m not sure how much of a mercy I’ll be able to show if I’m going to getting times, but men, Jesus said, and then he says, you’ll do greater things.
So I have to show more grace than he has. But then I say, but God, I’m only a man and it amazes me that we use the word of God so much for our own profit, but fail to use the word of God so much for the profit of the kingdom. We can say that I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me take that load out of context and use it for every blessing that we want to achieve. But then we don’t want to take that word out of context and use it to fill the kingdom or to expand the kingdom. I can do all things. So I’m going to go out, share the what again, or be with someone, have them up in these moments. That whole is a ground. And the promise that even when you go through the Valley of shadow, that you, I will fear no evil for gaudy you all with me, those beautiful problems in the world. They hold ground in my life as well. So yeah, my mind is thankfully at peace knowing we’re going to be in the fight, but we know we are not alone. There is a fourth one going to be with us and men.
Shea: I love that. I love the strength in that. Even in our own lives, when our own branches don’t bear fruit, he just takes them away. He whittles them off and we continue to grow in that church. As long as our minds, stay focused on him, right? Keep our minds on heaven and the power that’s in that the power that we see in being kingdom citizens. And I was looking at, the numbers of Christians in India and it’s like two or 3% of the population, but see two or 3% of that population is like 600 million. And so then that made me, like, I started thinking like, and this is a verse that we’ve been on. I’ve been pounding this verse like the last month man. Cause I love it. I love the idea that like we have so much strength when we, when we’re in Christ, we have so much strength when everything is just put into his hands, into his lap.
We’re not focusing on what’s going around us. We have our minds on, on the kingdom, right? We have our minds on heaven. We have our minds on God, on Christ and in Leviticus 26:8, watch this, this is the power that comes from this five of you shall chase a hundred and a hundred of you shall chase 10,000, 600 million Christians in India by standards, by percentages, by everything.
Michelle: There that’s some algebra.
Shea: Right, right, right, right. I know. I’d like to break that one out, figure out like, okay, hold on. If this 10 carry this and wait, if I keep taking this out, what’s the pattern, right. Does math. But it’s like, it’s like, man, so that two or 3%, when you look at it, like in that number two or 3%, it’s like what? And that’s all 600 million. I’m like, Whoa, there’s power in India. I mean like mad power in India.
And you know, and there’s other countries that have even more or even have less. But you know, when we’re attached to that kingdom and, and even in the worst of situations that I liked the obedience, by the way, I liked the obedience. Because let me tell you something on those days that it’s hard on those days that I falter or I slip it’s usually the obedience comes into play on a lot of it. Some of it’s mercy, but there are those times when you’re like, I need to shut up. I need to turn to God. I need to just look to him and you know what, basically, Shea shut up. You know, it’s kinda like that. It’s like, because the power is there. The power is there. I’m tired of the little cuts. I’m tired of the little bandaids. Yeah. We’re talking about what we have to do in the face of all of the, the suffocation, the suppression, the oppression,
Michelle: All, all the different avenues in which power of this world wants to keep us under their thumb. And one way that people tend to fight back is to hunt the Hunter, go after the oppressors and try to beat them at their own game, fight them politically the way they are coming at you, politically, et cetera. And Proverbs, you know, would it be me if I didn’t bring up Proverbs, but in Proverbs, there are so many different verses that talk about the danger of pursuing evil. It says, look straight ahead and fix your eyes on what lies before you mark out a straight path for your feet, stay on the safe path. Don’t get sidetracked, which makes me think of Nehemiah. Again. Don’t get sidetracked. Keep your feet from following evil, not just following as in worshiping or preferring evil, but also tracking and hunting it.
You can get sidetracked hunting evil. It will distract you from doing the things that would actually defeat evil in the first place. Like you said, the five and the hundred and how much damage they can do just by following God’s will. And, and like Georgie said, just by obeying how much damage one can do just by dying. When they’re called to die, without lifting a finger against the person, killing them. How much does that do versus picking up the rock and starting a rock fight right there. One is a supernatural level of confusion in people where they’re like, I don’t understand how he, why he did it like that. Like, there’s something different about this Jesus guy and the people that follow him versus, Oh, he’s not like he’s like everybody else. Some of the other verses in 12:3, it says wickedness never brings stability, but the godly have deep roots in the thick of it.
We have to remember that because the, the wickedness Georgy touched on it. It’s always changing. The laws are always changing. The rule books, always changing in the world. Like we, we never know like whoever’s in power is going to change how we have to act what we have to do. What hoops to jump through at the end of the day, he says in 5:23, that the wicked will die. For lack of self-control lost because of his great foolishness. And in 13:22, that the sinner’s wealth passes to the gap because the sinner’s wealth is stored up here, but our wealth is in eternity. So everything good worth anything worth keeping ends up ours. Anyway, it’s really easy to despise those that are persecuting us and holding us down and making it harder to loudly worship the Lord. But at the end of the day, we can still loudly worship the Lord.
Shea: So wait, hold up, man. Let me make sure I got this clear up in my mind. So you’re saying that the red tape doesn’t matter—
Michelle: Red tape, doesn’t beat the red ribbon,
Shea: The Crimson thread.
Michelle: Yeah! Yo, that’s a tee shirt. The red tape don’t beat the Crimson thread. This is how we roll y’all. This is how, this is how we got our first shirt with Georgy—mega plug—y’all should definitely be buying it to help us and our efforts to evangelize and spread the gospel worldwide.
Georgy: I love, I love the way it depicts so many characters, characters, people without fear. Again, obedience have to listen to them. If he calls you to stop. If he calls you to forgive you, forgive to take some time to be with them. But I think it is very important that our relation with Christ through these moments, through these trying times, the Bible, users would go up to the mountain before the break of Dawn and free. From that one moment of relationship, we can give everything out. But if we don’t allow ourselves to, by sitting in the presence of men, there’s too much. But I think what’s important for us to know that our source is not limited, want to change situations and circumstances and challenges where the change is not going to change. He’s not going to change is not going to change is not gonna change. Our healing is not gonna change. Our destination is not gonna change unchanging. God man, gonna be transformed completely. That’s all, that’s all.
Shea: Jesus was the, the only one who didn’t sleep or fall asleep. Yeah. He kept coming back to those who were sleeping, right? So our power is not in us.
Michelle: Definitely. One step farther: when we can’t sleep. When we have to sleep, he doesn’t have to. It’s just like, whatever. Like when we’re too scared to sleep well, you know, it’s good for God, us, man.
Shea: I love it. I love it. He goes before me, he goes behind me, man. And, and that’s just the power. And I think when people start to dial that in, in their relationship with him and, and it’s this, this ultimate trust, this crazy trust, then you start to understand like, wow, that’s, who’s on my side. You know, I hear, I hear, I am trying to, you know, hit the home run and he’s already done it. So yeah.
Geoergy: Yeah. We cannot do anything much more than what he has already done. Even in these times, looking after the community, that’s something that’s also important. We can be focusing on us and what we are going through. But Jesus often was with his people. Even when we see in the book of acts, we see the fellowship, we see the unity, you see people taking care of each other. That that is really important. We can be flooded with us, but I think more than us, it’s more about him and his church. You know, even if we come last, it should be fine. As long as the body of Christ and him himself comforts, you do this, you take your good dressed. You take care of your health. You take care of your lives, your family, everything, but ultimately no forget that we are to, to be United as a community.
And to keep going to that last sprint as the same body, we are not different organs. The index finger, doesn’t say I’m gonna live my own life from the body. Then that spring that no longer lives with the body continues to live, right? It’s the same way. If the branch is cut off, the branch doesn’t live anymore. It’s the same thing. So as a church and serving the church, it goes hand in hand. Let’s not isolate ourselves. And in such moments, reader and John and the book of acts were in jail. The church was still praying for them. That is the power. And that is knowing that, Hey, I’ve got backup. You know, even if I’m being, being beaten, when I’m praying, I still know people who are free and that cannot be beaten. Amen angels and the authority and the power of God is still with them. It’s still with me, but there was a joy and there was a comfort for me, knowing that, Hey, this someone like you guys, we ship, you know, life events. And we’re like, Hey, I see you so much comfort knowing that I there’s someone who is backing me up right now, I’m sleeping at 6:00 AM. I was leaving, but I know you guys are probably up back of my head. I’m like, yeah.
Michelle: Right!
Shea: What an episode! I don’t even know, man. It’s just like power packed. You know, we, we get, we get the word of Michelle. It’s like what we got we’re we’re seeing his silence looking at each other now. And then Georgie comes in with the, with, with beautiful word about how we trust in God and, and the community of the church. And, and you know that we’re, we’re all in this together. And you know, it all starts in one place being servants, being slaves, being Christ centered. When we don’t think of ourselves and we think of others than we’re always covering someone in prayer. And I’m gonna leave with one verse because I liked how Georgie and I referenced it at the beginning of the episode, because I think it really, plays an important role in this red tape or this being cast down type of feeling or feeling like, you know, we’re losing ground somewhere. We’re not, the kingdom is victorious in second Corinthians four, seven through nine. It says, but we have this treasure in earthen vessels that all the excellence of the power may be of God. And not of us. We are hard-pressed on every side yet. Not crushed. We are perplexed, but not in despair, persecuted, but not forsaken struck down, but not destroyed. God has us.
Michelle: Man. This has been, I think this is our most epic close out of a season where we’re only in season three y’all, but like we have, we’ve set the bar for us. So, but you know, we, we are here. We are here. I mean, you all know we’re here because we never, we never stopped season is right around the corner. But we are here to pray with you. We are here to pray with you while you’re sleeping, if we’re awake. So go up to the pantry podcast.com and submit your prayer requests, your questions, your comments, and help us continue to just spread this word to other people that need to hear it. You have no idea how useful your ratings and reviews and shares and subscribes are to help us be discoverable to other people. And as always, you can follow us at Facebook, Instagram, and Gab at @ThePantryPodcast, and we will see y’all talk to y’all next time.
Everyone: Bye.
Michelle: Yay! Georgy said bye! Our guests never say, bye! Yay! Ok—*fade out*
